Comments on: The future of the programming languages. What about Java? http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/ Writing about software and human behavior... Tue, 16 Feb 2010 19:53:40 +0100 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: Evolving the Java language: generics were hard to implement | Coder-friendly http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/comment-page-1/#comment-45 Evolving the Java language: generics were hard to implement | Coder-friendly Sat, 09 May 2009 14:40:47 +0000 http://www.coderfriendly.com/?p=219#comment-45 [...] a previous post, I’ve said that Java is not adapted to concurrency and that, in the next years, some [...] [...] a previous post, I’ve said that Java is not adapted to concurrency and that, in the next years, some [...]

]]> By: The future of Java. Am I wrong? | Coder-friendly http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/comment-page-1/#comment-24 The future of Java. Am I wrong? | Coder-friendly Tue, 21 Apr 2009 18:13:22 +0000 http://www.coderfriendly.com/?p=219#comment-24 [...] would like to come back on my last post named “The future of programming languages. What about Java?“. First, I want to thank you for your comments even when you express a disagreement: [...] [...] would like to come back on my last post named “The future of programming languages. What about Java?“. First, I want to thank you for your comments even when you express a disagreement: [...]

]]> By: Dominique De Vito http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/comment-page-1/#comment-23 Dominique De Vito Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:43:47 +0000 http://www.coderfriendly.com/?p=219#comment-23 I should mention here that this conclusion is derivated from an Einstein's quote. Let's give back to Einstein what it belongs. I should mention here that this conclusion is derivated from an Einstein’s quote. Let’s give back to Einstein what it belongs.

]]> By: coder-friendly http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/comment-page-1/#comment-22 coder-friendly Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:06:31 +0000 http://www.coderfriendly.com/?p=219#comment-22 Hello Dominique, Thank you for your comment. I have to admit that I have never used Groovy, I put it on my TODO list ;-). I agree with your remarks on the declarative road of annotations. And I read your posts and I like one of your conclusion: "With other words, if you except something new in your life, just try to do also something new. So, why not trying FP?". Hello Dominique,
Thank you for your comment. I have to admit that I have never used Groovy, I put it on my TODO list ;-) . I agree with your remarks on the declarative road of annotations. And I read your posts and I like one of your conclusion: “With other words, if you except something new in your life, just try to do also something new. So, why not trying FP?”.

]]> By: Dominique De Vito http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/comment-page-1/#comment-21 Dominique De Vito Mon, 20 Apr 2009 20:29:06 +0000 http://www.coderfriendly.com/?p=219#comment-21 I am quite inline/agree with the 4 points ;-) (1) the Domain Specific Language (internal and external DSL) (2) the declarative aspect (concentrate on the what and not on the how) (3) the convergence between static and dynamic languages (4) the emergence of functional languages (imperative ones are not appropriated to multi-threading processing) (1) Almost everybody has noticed the rise of DSL out there. I can add some languages are more suitable than others for building DSL, like those derivated from Java: Groovy and Scala (2) the introduction of annotations, into a mainstream language like Java, is the beginning of the declarative road (3) static and dynamic languages do converge. For example, read my post about JS and Java: "A false piece of news may become real as Java and JS move closer" http://www.jroller.com/dmdevito/entry/a_false_piece_of_news (4) and, yes, functional languages do emergence. Java, and more than that, C#, have more and more functional features. I have written old posts (in 2005) about it: "Thoughts about Java, C# future and OCaml (?) relationships" - http://www.jroller.com/dmdevito/entry/thoughts_about_java_c_future - and "More ramblings on programming languages" - http://www.jroller.com/dmdevito/entry/more_ramblings_on_programming_languages - and more recently "Functional programming on-going adoption as a side-effect" - http://www.jroller.com/dmdevito/entry/functional_programming_on_going_adoption I am quite inline/agree with the 4 points ;-)
(1) the Domain Specific Language (internal and external DSL)
(2) the declarative aspect (concentrate on the what and not on the how)
(3) the convergence between static and dynamic languages
(4) the emergence of functional languages (imperative ones are not appropriated to multi-threading processing)

(1) Almost everybody has noticed the rise of DSL out there. I can add some languages are more suitable than others for building DSL, like those derivated from Java: Groovy and Scala
(2) the introduction of annotations, into a mainstream language like Java, is the beginning of the declarative road
(3) static and dynamic languages do converge. For example, read my post about JS and Java: “A false piece of news may become real as Java and JS move closer” http://www.jroller.com/dmdevito/entry/a_false_piece_of_news
(4) and, yes, functional languages do emergence. Java, and more than that, C#, have more and more functional features. I have written old posts (in 2005) about it: “Thoughts about Java, C# future and OCaml (?) relationships” – http://www.jroller.com/dmdevito/entry/thoughts_about_java_c_future – and “More ramblings on programming languages” – http://www.jroller.com/dmdevito/entry/more_ramblings_on_programming_languages – and more recently “Functional programming on-going adoption as a side-effect” – http://www.jroller.com/dmdevito/entry/functional_programming_on_going_adoption

]]> By: coder-friendly http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/comment-page-1/#comment-20 coder-friendly Sun, 19 Apr 2009 16:37:55 +0000 http://www.coderfriendly.com/?p=219#comment-20 Hello Michael, Even if you are aware about thread-safety, you can make mistakes. Brian Goetz gives this definition: "A class is thread-safe if it behaves correctly when accessed from multiple threads, regardless of the scheduling or interleaving of the execution of those threads by the runtime environment, and with no additional synchronization or other coordination on the part of the calling code." So, when you design a thread-safe class, you select a strategy on which the calling code can rely. You can read the javadoc of <a href="http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/util/concurrent/CopyOnWriteArrayList.html" rel="nofollow">CopyOnWriteArrayList</a>: the author has chosen between cost and efficiency. There are many articles of Brian Goetz on the <a href="http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/views/java/libraryview.jsp?sort_by=Relevance&show_abstract=true&show_all=false&search_flag=true&topic_by=All+topics+and+related+products&type_by=All+Types&search_by=goetz&Submit.x=0&Submit.y=0" rel="nofollow">developerWorks</a>. I hope I have answered to your question. Hello Michael,
Even if you are aware about thread-safety, you can make mistakes. Brian Goetz gives this definition: “A class is thread-safe if it behaves correctly when accessed from multiple threads, regardless of the scheduling or interleaving of the execution of those threads by the runtime environment, and with no additional synchronization or other coordination on the part of the calling code.” So, when you design a thread-safe class, you select a strategy on which the calling code can rely. You can read the javadoc of CopyOnWriteArrayList: the author has chosen between cost and efficiency. There are many articles of Brian Goetz on the developerWorks.
I hope I have answered to your question.

]]> By: Michael http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/comment-page-1/#comment-19 Michael Sun, 19 Apr 2009 16:06:59 +0000 http://www.coderfriendly.com/?p=219#comment-19 I haven't read Brian Goetz’s book but what is the rationel for annotating not-threadsafe versus threadsafe. It's much more likely that ppl who write threadsafe classes to even be aware of threadsafety as opposed to ppl who write not-threadsafe classes - beginners and alike. I haven’t read Brian Goetz’s book but what is the rationel for annotating not-threadsafe versus threadsafe. It’s much more likely that ppl who write threadsafe classes to even be aware of threadsafety as opposed to ppl who write not-threadsafe classes – beginners and alike.

]]> By: siva http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/comment-page-1/#comment-17 siva Sun, 19 Apr 2009 11:30:01 +0000 http://www.coderfriendly.com/?p=219#comment-17 custom forths (small, simple and sexy) will be the future custom forths (small, simple and sexy) will be the future

]]> By: coder-friendly http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/comment-page-1/#comment-16 coder-friendly Sun, 19 Apr 2009 09:08:32 +0000 http://www.coderfriendly.com/?p=219#comment-16 Hello Bob, I know that it may sound ridiculous but for me, it's not. Previously, I was convinced that the verbosity of Java was not a problem. Here, I just say that, for me, it is a problem to code without those annotations. I always need to read the documentation to know whether the classes are thread-safe or not (and it is common to not find the information). And when you use a lot of external APIs, it is terrible to develop in multi-threaded systems. If we develop a new system with new APIs developed by great coders, then, I'm okay, Java is right for developing concurrent program. But, in the real world, I have never seen this kind of project. I don't say that it is the only reason to look at other languages, it is just the one which has the more impacts on my daily work. If we browse the blogs, we can find a lot of bloggers who explain their own reasons. I hope that this explanation let you understand (I don't say share ;-) ) my point of view. Coderfriendly Hello Bob,
I know that it may sound ridiculous but for me, it’s not. Previously, I was convinced that the verbosity of Java was not a problem. Here, I just say that, for me, it is a problem to code without those annotations. I always need to read the documentation to know whether the classes are thread-safe or not (and it is common to not find the information). And when you use a lot of external APIs, it is terrible to develop in multi-threaded systems.
If we develop a new system with new APIs developed by great coders, then, I’m okay, Java is right for developing concurrent program. But, in the real world, I have never seen this kind of project.
I don’t say that it is the only reason to look at other languages, it is just the one which has the more impacts on my daily work. If we browse the blogs, we can find a lot of bloggers who explain their own reasons.
I hope that this explanation let you understand (I don’t say share ;-) ) my point of view.
Coderfriendly

]]> By: coder-friendly http://www.coderfriendly.com/2009/04/19/the-future-of-the-programming-languages-what-about-java/comment-page-1/#comment-15 coder-friendly Sun, 19 Apr 2009 09:01:03 +0000 http://www.coderfriendly.com/?p=219#comment-15 Hello James Iry, Sorry for the error. I have never developed in Scala at this time. So, thank for your explanation. Coderfriendly Hello James Iry,
Sorry for the error. I have never developed in Scala at this time. So, thank for your explanation.
Coderfriendly

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